Girlfriend >Wife > Girlfriend to another man> Vixen> Hotwife > ?
- Thread starter Phun Times 727
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Sorry, I have been so busy. Updates...well the date happened.
This was somewhat of a step forward in the HW lifestyle for her in that she decided on doing it, set up the date and made it all happen completely on her own. It was a small baby step. I sort of thought it might happen via a bull setup through her friend but I think this was a way to dip a toe in the water with someone we know. This was also completing something we began a year ago that never saw its way to completion at that time. I don't know if this was just checking that box or if she intends to continue meeting with him. He doesn't know either by the way as I talked to him over the weekend and he also thought the three of us were getting together up til right before the date. I have talked to her about it and she hasn't really committed one way or the other. It could have been just her putting an exclamation point on the way things fizzled or it could be a new chapter for the three of us or it could be the HW step forward. She might not know herself so I am just letting her process it. Sorry I don't have anything more exciting.
This was somewhat of a step forward in the HW lifestyle for her in that she decided on doing it, set up the date and made it all happen completely on her own. It was a small baby step. I sort of thought it might happen via a bull setup through her friend but I think this was a way to dip a toe in the water with someone we know. This was also completing something we began a year ago that never saw its way to completion at that time. I don't know if this was just checking that box or if she intends to continue meeting with him. He doesn't know either by the way as I talked to him over the weekend and he also thought the three of us were getting together up til right before the date. I have talked to her about it and she hasn't really committed one way or the other. It could have been just her putting an exclamation point on the way things fizzled or it could be a new chapter for the three of us or it could be the HW step forward. She might not know herself so I am just letting her process it. Sorry I don't have anything more exciting.
I'll have to say that the tone of your post is pretty blurry. Even with you checking in with "him" it doesn't sound like he's in the loop either. I think you've been wise to "let her process things" on her own but it leaves you in an very unaware position. The fact that you had assumed something would be set up through her "friend" (I gather you mean the friend that got her started) means that you were guessing how things would go. Your post makes it sound like you're just along for the ride and uncertain about what happens next.
Do you have a sense of where she is at in her own head? What has her demeanor been like otherwise during the regular day to day life? I know I'm just guessing myself but it sure sounds like something has changed and it's hard to tell what her decision to completely set things up on her own means.
So blurry is a good way to describe things. We have a hotwife friend, she didn't start us on this but has been a bit of a coach for lack of a better term. The last several months have been a movement towards comfort with some hotwife activity. It is a bit of a stretch but we have been trying to do things in a safe environment where things are not moving too quickly and she remains comfortable. Part of that is her being at ease discussing what she wants and taking ownership of the process. We were there in her previous relationship but this is somewhat of a new path. Understand we got into this with me pushing her, now she is acting not on my pushing but on her own desires. This date was essentially her taking a lead by setting up the date. I could have done it and it probably would have gone fine (a bit differently as I would have had all 3 of us get together and it would have been a threesome). She had something she wanted to do, and she made that happen. Now the why of her wanting it is two part. First she had unfinished business and seems like he did too, secondly, we chose him originally as he is a good friend and she was open to the idea from the onset so the attraction was there.
As far as demeanor, we have had a tremendous amount of communication and have been closer relationship wise as we have been exploring this new situation. The one thing we really haven't done is the nitty gritty talk of exactly what they did. I am respecting her sense of comfort talking about it and it will unfold at a natural pace.
As far as demeanor, we have had a tremendous amount of communication and have been closer relationship wise as we have been exploring this new situation. The one thing we really haven't done is the nitty gritty talk of exactly what they did. I am respecting her sense of comfort talking about it and it will unfold at a natural pace.
It's good to hear that you feel closer relationship wise. That's important! It is also important that your communication is not inhibited by any type of fear or worry. I get that this step of her taking the initiative is a desired thing. It shows that it's not just you wanting this. I proves a sort of "buying in" on her part.
I can only imagine how difficult it is for you to be patient as you await discussing the "nitty gritty" talk. I also imagine the difficult and precarious place you're in altogether. You don't want to ruin things for her and you don't want things ruined for you either. When you do finally get to have that discussion you might try explaining how anxious it makes you feel when you are out of the loop. "Unfinished business" is vague and in that space you are left to your imagination and that doesn't always restrict itself from the negative thoughts you can't help but consider.
Yeah, blurry, but you have a lot going for you.
I can only imagine how difficult it is for you to be patient as you await discussing the "nitty gritty" talk. I also imagine the difficult and precarious place you're in altogether. You don't want to ruin things for her and you don't want things ruined for you either. When you do finally get to have that discussion you might try explaining how anxious it makes you feel when you are out of the loop. "Unfinished business" is vague and in that space you are left to your imagination and that doesn't always restrict itself from the negative thoughts you can't help but consider.
Yeah, blurry, but you have a lot going for you.
The unfinished business stems from how we got started originally. We identified our friend as someone who would make sense to begin with as we both like him and trust him and there was always a little weird attraction thing there. When we tried, it was going to be my wife joining him and his then girlfriend but it barely got off the ground due to their (her) preoccupation with condoms. It ended with my wife 3 blowjobs in and no sex and a lot of sexual frustration so she wanted to finish that saga. Based on him reaching out 10 minutes after he and the GF broke up I think I am safe in saying he did too.
I am curious if she wants this to be ongoing or if she was just looking to make a point with him.
Either way we are making a leap here. We are going from me pushing to fulfill my fantasy and her going along with it, to her being comfortable in this newly presented freedom and identifying desires she would like to act upon and discussing them.
So now that the dust has settled a bit we have had a chance to really discuss what happened, spoiler alert she had sex with him. I think it was a safe assumption that was going to happen. It was it good, from what she said, and it went on for several rounds. My question was if it will be an ongoing thing for her/us. She isn't looking to recreate what we just went through with her boyfriend, meaning not a regular weekly thing (was actually several times a week but who is counting) but possibly semi regular. I think we both agree it would be hotter if it were less frequent but more happening. We also have other hotwife things we are working towards that will occupy our time.
Thanks for the update. I have a better understanding of what "unfinished business" meant now. Your question regarding about the ongoing nature of this new development is telling. Since she's taking the initiative and "ownership" does it feel like there is little less communication that leaves you in that "blurry" place? Is she aware that it causes a certain amount of anxiety on your part?
Regarding the "frequency" part, it's obvious to me that you are well aware of it. Even in jest you say, "...but who's counting" is telling too. YOU are clearly sensitive to the frequency and the implications of it. Personally I think it's great she's taking more ownership of her role. I think (and it's only my opinion) that if she does so without informing you or considering what the affect may be on you is a slippery slope.
I also feel (once again only my opinion) that having less frequency is an important thing. It's my personal belief that frequency leads to becoming a routine and that routine diminishes enthusiasm and thrill. I believe that it is a natural progression when you do ANYTHING, sexual or not, frequently the experience gradually loses it potency. I know in my case "routine sex" has been the biggest factor in diminishing desire and excitement.
I am intrigued by your "other" hot wife ideas and what they could possibly be. Thanks again for your update!
Regarding the "frequency" part, it's obvious to me that you are well aware of it. Even in jest you say, "...but who's counting" is telling too. YOU are clearly sensitive to the frequency and the implications of it. Personally I think it's great she's taking more ownership of her role. I think (and it's only my opinion) that if she does so without informing you or considering what the affect may be on you is a slippery slope.
I also feel (once again only my opinion) that having less frequency is an important thing. It's my personal belief that frequency leads to becoming a routine and that routine diminishes enthusiasm and thrill. I believe that it is a natural progression when you do ANYTHING, sexual or not, frequently the experience gradually loses it potency. I know in my case "routine sex" has been the biggest factor in diminishing desire and excitement.
I am intrigued by your "other" hot wife ideas and what they could possibly be. Thanks again for your update!
So it really is not the purpose for me to have anxiety but for her to take ownership. It is still a newish situation so naturally I am still adjusting and a bit curious. When she got home from the date I wanted to get the full rundown but it was super late and I wanted to wait until she wanted to tell me. Last year was great but there was a point where frequency was getting to be a bit much, and I only did part of the trips over there. We did a lot of driving (and other things) and I think over time it lessened the wow factor. It would be easy for us at the moment to simply do what we did last year with our local friend, he lives 10 minutes away and has a key to our house. It would really be that easy and to be honest I think he and I would be very on board with doing that. The thing is it doesn't advance her ownership and testing the waters in the HW lifestyle which is what we have both decided is a direction we want to explore.
We were given a list of goals that our HW friend laid out as experiences she believes would be valuable in my wife's exploration. It is fairly detailed but since you asked. In case you were wondering, number one was her date last week. This could take some time and requires certain comfort levels along the way. There isn't an order but we started at one.
1.Allow yourself to experience sex with someone you have had a long running attraction to but for whatever reason would not be able to advance things with. It can be a one time thing or a regular thing. Give in to your libido.
2.Allow yourself to experience sex with a new person you are very attracted to and just recently met in your personal or professional life. Be very clear early on that sex is on the table and cut through as much of the social norms as possible to fast track to the bedroom while that infatuation is present. Satisfy the need while it is fresh and hot. This is a one time meeting, although you can repeat it with others the person would need to be different.
3.Allow yourself the experience of having sex with a person who is super attracted to you and has been for some time. The person you were never going to give a shot. Be very clear all you want is sex and fast track the process. This is that guy that has been trying to talk to you for awhile at you local bar, maybe the barista or even bartender, delivery driver etc who always makes sure to try and talk to you, the coworker who you know has the hots for you This person is going to go above and beyond to make it an incredible experience for the option of a repeated performance. That will not happen. This is also a one time thing.
4.Allow yourself to experience sex with a bull or bulls from the group.
5.Recruit a new bull into the group. Locate a bull socially or through a dating profile, screen/qualify them and get them tested and comfortable with being a bull within our group of bulls and invite them to a play weekend.
So we had a bit of an awkward situation arise over the weekend. We have a female friend/neighbor that both my wife and I hang out with. We consider her a good friend. After a couple of odd situations lately my wife revealed to our friend our hotwife situation in order to explain why a couple of situations were the way they were. I did not think we would ever let that out as there are only a handful of people on the planet that know and that is only because of direct involvement. I do trust her as far as being discreet but it is still a thing that likely should have remained confidential. I was a bit stressed about facing her for the first time but I managed to get through it and save face. I did offer to explain everything and oddly she took me up on it. I wound up sitting on her front porch talking for 90 minutes just the two of us. She had a lot of questions as you might imagine, things like the rules, what motivated this, limits and our plans etc. A year ago I could have laid down a quick spiel to describe exactly what we were doing. Its a bit different now with us wandering into new territory. I wanted her to hear it from me also so she had my perspective and to back up my wife. I feel better after talking about it but still a bit unsettled that she knows.
It has been a time of adjustment for us as we have moved into this new arrangement and kind of hard to describe so I have waited a bit for us to get more settled. We decided that since we were going down the hotwife path we would lean a bit on her hotwife friend for not only guidance but help in making things happen. She has a long time bull she meets with that she felt would be our best option to start with. He is an older man (older than me), married and plays but his wife does not. He is large in size and libido, his wife stopped being able to keep up many years ago and this is what keeps the relationship in check for them. We were told he is a gentle yet effective and experienced lover We met with him and both felt comfortable in moving forward. He unfortunately prefers one on one vs threesome so I haven't really had a chance to participate so watching has been all of my sexual involvement and that only happened twice but either way it seems to be a good step forward for my wife. I never really pictured myself not being directly involved would excite me like it does. We talk about it but I tend to get excited and really eager and I have to remind myself that in order to get where we are headed I need to get comfortable in the more passive role I am currently in. Relationship wise I feel we are communicating more than ever and spending much more time together even if it is less physical in nature..
Regarding your "awkward situation" post, I'm curious to know how much discussion you had with her about your rules and limits? Did she give you her opinions about those? I have a sneaking suspicion that she was curious about what you got out of the situation and if you had any issues with jealousy or about your wife and her playing on her own.
Regarding your "new arrangement" phase. It's great that your are excited about it. I'm sure that helps your wife.
So, what is the plan? Is the "bull" from your hotwife friend a transitionary player in your scheme? If he is, have you talked about how long you'll need him? Is there a goal to find his replacement?
Are you prepared for a long term situation of not participating? How passive are you going to be in this "new arrangement"? Does that mean that you have no say in things like when and where and how often?
I'm always thinking about how easy it would be at the beginning and how things like behavior and attitudes naturally evolve over time, especially over a longer time. I can see how giving her autonomy to become comfortable is important. I just think a lot about what happens when a wife becomes comfortable and is having a great sexual experience but from the husband's experience it could be perceived as a routine that excludes him more than includes him.
I have faith that you and your wife are aware enough to consider the potential pitfalls and not leave those things unaddressed.
So, what is the plan? Is the "bull" from your hotwife friend a transitionary player in your scheme? If he is, have you talked about how long you'll need him? Is there a goal to find his replacement?
Are you prepared for a long term situation of not participating? How passive are you going to be in this "new arrangement"? Does that mean that you have no say in things like when and where and how often?
I'm always thinking about how easy it would be at the beginning and how things like behavior and attitudes naturally evolve over time, especially over a longer time. I can see how giving her autonomy to become comfortable is important. I just think a lot about what happens when a wife becomes comfortable and is having a great sexual experience but from the husband's experience it could be perceived as a routine that excludes him more than includes him.
I have faith that you and your wife are aware enough to consider the potential pitfalls and not leave those things unaddressed.
Well, the reality is we are learning as we go. As far as the bull goes he is somewhat of a transition and based on our talks and comfort level our friend thought he would be a good choice. She started to meet with him years ago and has continued to meet with him at times although she has an established "roster" of others as she is well experienced in this area, we are not but open. I haven't posted much lately as I really haven't been able to define what is happening as we had to get through some comfort level type stuff as far as desire vs comfort and getting to a point where my wife has been willing to act upon desires while testing boundaries of comfort. We have taken some baby steps and she is getting more comfortable. It might sound silly but until recently it was all relationship type sex even when she was seeing a boyfriend. This is different and she and I are gradually moving to her entertaining her desires and when she is ready act upon them. We went to a weekend event at her friends with the understanding we would be good with a series of outcomes, we could hang out with a number of the bulls there and it could be as simple as just meeting and talking and flirting up to whatever happens but we had a pretty good idea of what we were going to do and it pretty much went that way. We met the bull she is currently seeing, after some hanging out she opted for oral sex with him and that was the extent at that point. We discussed thigs and she said she was looking to have him in a full sex capacity. She reached out and made arrangements and within a week she met with him alone. I was not present but did get a report of how things went and they went well as she has seen him several times since. The nature of this situation is that he prefers one on one and doesn't really want to be watched but we did manage to arrange for me to watch a couple times.. I am excited to hear about it even if I am not there and the reality is this is one situation and there will be other opportunities as other situations open up.
As far as how easy things are or not. This "phase" has been one of the more challenging. It was far easier to have a regular and know what was happening/when it was happening etc. The autonomy comes with a price. First of all, things don't always work out, people can be flaky or personalities don't mesh but it is for the most part "dating while married". You have something set up and maybe it works out but in some cases it doesn't. We have had to rely more heavily on her friend and her bulls than we would like but the reality is they are comfortable in the role/screened/no surprises. As far as my wife meeting a bull on her own she has had a couple of meetings through dating sites etc and neither went beyond casual meeting in a public place as my wife didn't feel comfortable around them. Its tough because she needs the autonomy but would still like the security of me being around but the idea for right now is I am not around for it and so that is difficult. We really have only had success with the one bull through her friend so far but do have other options with other bulls through her. Hurry up/slow down has been the theme. No options leads to options then a delay as comfort levels adjust so it has been difficult.
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